Save BeOS

Posted 30 Aug 2001 at 08:43 UTC by stevej Share This is currently asking for petitioners to express their feelings to Palm, the new owner of BeOS and BeIA, regarding what they should do with BeOS.

As many of us know, Palm Inc recently acquired the intellectual property of Be (in the form of BeOS and BeIA) in exchange for 11MM$ USD worth of Palm shares and plan to use the source to help strengthen their products.

Palm said that they were not expecting the sort of media attention the acquisition received and have publically stated that they have no plans to further development on BeOS at this time. Let's change that.

As an avid user of BeOS until the, IMHO, BeIA fiasco (meaning when Be decided to stop developing on BeOS and focus instead on the Internet Appliance market thus leaving people like me dead in the water for what to do with our vast stores of BeOS knowledge) I would really like to see BeOS back in the public light, especially if it were Open Sourced. Hopefully with this new petition we can have a chance to express to Palm that WE WANT AN OPEN SOURCE BEOS!

ahem. the petition is currently at

Is it possible though?, posted 30 Aug 2001 at 15:54 UTC by neurogato » (Journeyer)

As much as I'd like to see BeOS opened up, there are two potential barriers that I can see preventing this:

  1. Licensed parts of BeOS may prevent any open source effort from releasing the entire operating system, a la the early stages of Mozilla development. Not knowing the innards of BeOS that well (it's been a while - version 3 - since I played seriously with it), I don't know how true this may be.
  2. Palm may want to use components within PalmOS (or whatever related venture they wish to use BeOS for), which again would impede a full open source release.

Having such a stylish OS opened up to development in such a fashion can only be a good thing for the community, and I hope BeFAQs and other supporters are successful. [wanders off to sign petition]

Browsed the survey, posted 30 Aug 2001 at 17:34 UTC by whytheluckystiff » (Master)

This is a great effort at least and regardless of what the end goal is, I know it's important for the BeOS community to have a unified voice and demonstrate the magnitude this particular operating system has had. I really support this effort and hope I can contribute something to bringing the OS back.

Personally, I've had trouble getting BeOS to work on my machine (probably because I ventured no further than the Personal Edition). So I don't have much experience using the OS consistently. I have read through the API docs though, and I try to stay abreast of and BeNews and so on.

Scanning the survey, it seemed that demonstrating faithful use of BeOS was heavily highlighted. Not wanting to bring the stats down or affect the survey negatively, I decided to hold off. I'm sure there's plenty of other people in my scenario who may not be active BeOS users but support the OS to a degree and are wondering how to best contribute. Any advice?

This I can say: I am perfectly willing to purchase the Professional Edition and start using BeOS and come back to the survey later when I am better informed. So is there a time frame for this petition? I absolutely love the OS, I've just been sort of lazy about participating right off.

I suppose the best answer is to purchase the BeOS/Gobe bundle today and just get involved.

Swinging fists after the brawl, posted 30 Aug 2001 at 17:34 UTC by Zaitcev » (Master)

If someone has accumulated "vast BeOS knowledge", it is his or her loss. They always knew the risk of tying themself to a piece of proprietary software.

Write off your failed investment and hack on Nautilus and/or XF86.

proprietary OS devotion is silly, posted 30 Aug 2001 at 23:54 UTC by splork » (Master)

I was an OS/2 user since 2.0 was released in 1992 until sometime in early 1998 when I just stopped using it because I could see how antiquated parts of its design were and there was obviously no useful desktop future for it. Linux and FreeBSD had become my OSes of choice by that time.

No matter how cool BeOS really is, doesn't have anyone to work on it and has no significant number of serious users, its in a worse boat than OS/2. Go ahead, open it up and give the fanatics a place to play happily ignoring the real world.

This is the problem with proprietary desktop OSes: there is no way in hell they can enter a market already dominated by two other proprietary OSes (windows and macos). The most significant OS innovation has already taken place, now everyone is just playing catch up on well developed features found in older OSes. Opening BeOS up would make it exist longer, but is that really a good thing?

"he's dead Jim" - bones

Perhap Beos shall live it we love someone's creation enough it will love us back., posted 5 Sep 2001 at 13:25 UTC by mirwin » (Master)

I find it appalling that we think punitive measures inflicted upon ourselves for loving an operating system lovingly crafted by someone else held in economic bondage.

I propose that we collaborate a bit and be a little synergistic. If we can generate enough potential benefits for ourselves and the company that holds this portion of creation captive over the black holes of anti swirling grumpy gray matter, then perhaps they will feel better about themselves and their future open business relationship with open communities that we presume to speak for.

I was logged into earlier cruising with one of the best concise pieces of systems engineering that I have done recently, thus sparing all of you the catastropohe of mirbot computing strange attractors in mirwin's diary.

In the middle of this I encountered black despair. Checking I found the victim was ONE OF MY OWN APPRENTICES! Further he has back certified me apprentice in a blind leap of faith reaching for redemption or salvation via the slender assistance of a total stranger in clear violation of the published site standards by both parties attempting to negotiate some leverage with compete strangers over the internet. I hope that this does not come to the site administrator's attention before appropriate networking methods can be evolved. So I am motivated cause I got big trouble on the horizon. We all know what that means! Fast footwork in building trust relationships or edges faster than the existing buddy nodes can decertify me. lol

I speak literally when I say that if I am decertifed over this I shall eventually establish a competing institute or join MITs and show them how to setup some junior levels to work with their students and masters. In the interest of expediency I am hoping that the owners of this fine facility and concept are open to developing it rapidly in the interested of increasing the availibility of high performance computing (HPC) to medical researchers worldwide via the internet. I had the necessary robot buddy (rex) prototype conceptually outlined to initiate operations and while on a roll moved on into open business planning that we the community could present to the site owner to show them that we were open to expanding rapidly in ways compatible with their goals as long as our need for a safe effective training facility for robotics systems engineers (rse) was met via a fair structure where our knowledge bases and expertise were not exploited for selfish personal gain but rather mutual fair benefits returned to all. Including our buddies the business owners and site administrators.

While I was finishing checking some calculations and considering whether cutting and pasting between gnumeric, dia, composer and the site html editor would really be feasible when my dialer, the site, my keeper or the universe hung up on me ..... I started to publish a synopsis here at advogato but remembered that when I am wildly fractally synergizing in all directions at once it screws up the recentlog for other who are busy with valuable work.

Consider that this apprentice in despair is possibly many things including these possibilities:

1.) A grandmaster looking for worthy apprentices.

2.) A gatekeeper running a routine sanity check. Better this may be some of the automated systems coming online to locate and report possible problems ..... BTW gnome very nice prototype. If higher non visible levels exist consider adding task to add an encrypted second vote to the voting process script that sends a parallel central ballot to gnome central sanity check, board, administrator where the parallel secret vote can be tallied and used for comparison purposes with the official published vote. Any divergence is evidence of process tampering or coercion creeping into the lovely gnome community. The place is a jewel and it must be protected at all costs! I can help some worthy apprenctice justify the resources necessary to implement this feedback loop and some lucky rse can assist with the logical circuit design environment so that a non technical but talented site adminstrator's assistant can maintain the feedback loops connections and distribution as the trusted webs flows fluctuate. Later we automate with audit trail for periodic inspection but for now we prototype manually so we can write reasonable specifications for various components that are fun to work on for student personnel. We need to provide work worhty of their effort and the resources and mentoring to get the job done. As they progress they will help their buddies help themselves and the next wave. Obviously in the current state triage this is low priority, just as obviously it will greatly increase the capabilities and productivity of our professional, paid, volunteer, and student community participants.

3.) A neophyte in despair. Very dangerous! Suicide statistics are very grim at the moment. Much larger than zero.

A situation fraught with potential, just like every day of your life when you love yourself, your neighbors, and the wondrous universe all around us. Stop abusing your animals, children, assoiciates, etc. If you are loving them well they will notice when the love goes away. A spanking is a signal that a source of love in a small universe has hidden some of its warmth until a juvenile has returned to safe boundaries to play freely, safely and securely within. Leashes are necessary because we have ignorant adults incompetent to discharge their voluntarily assumed responsibility to a junior life form or point of awareness within the larger universe we share. Most children have the ability to grow to the capabilities we are all now learning. If we do not put it there they will not have twenty years of scar tissue and brain damage to overcome as we all do. Lower life forms are at our mercy but keep in mind the universe is watching and there will be consequences.

Required: Resources of all kinds for everybody.

Given: Resources of all kinds all around us.

Solution: Develop some resources and give them freely to your lovers and/or trust/prestige webs as your confidence rises that the recipients can safely manage the resources. Sheer consumption is OK. Consider that most parasites receiving a huge influx of resources will quickly grow, often killing the host.

Specifics: I need volunteer distribution networks to intelligently manage flow of recycled materials to where they can be effectively applied in mission critical training institutes (heinlein outreach @ mit ??) ( Interesting MH would be mental health and we shall have to get them involved. The systems must be prototyped on informed adult protege volunteers quickly because we already have juveniles at mingling freely and unsupervised/unmentored with dangerous technologies.

This is a potential market for very large numbers of handhelds or web applicances which are required for coordination and routing. The owners of BEOS should surely be interested. Not enough? I can generate more but it will work better if someone who sees some possibilities shares them with us here in on front page or in their diaries.

Presentations, clarifications and task plans can all proceed in parallel. We do nothing until we are ready enough to assure victory but I need to get back to my apprentice and show him this apparent motion so he hangs around long enough for me to truly love him/her a little and see if they will love me a little back. Can get cold sometimes.

I will post the fractal food bank draft plan in account idot at advogato.

If you wish to get started before it is available somebody go get it from, run a google for Michael R. Irwin, Fractal Food Bank Agents or something like that. A helpful apprentice or observer on the bounce might post the link here .... an apprentice I guess. Observers need to observe and take data anyway. We still pretty rough at this. Somebody might want to do a post mortem and tell us what worked well and what did not.

I will be back here in an hour or two. I look forward to working with anybody available to assist me with this matter. It is authentic and urgent. It is very risky playing with strangers on the internet, mutual obligations are implied and incurred. We really should get some rough guidelines, safety tips, recommended procedures, etc. etc. in place so our apprentices can play safely, well and productively here confident that we journeyers have access to masters and resouces necessary to resolve problems. If they can they will cheerfully reduce risks and watch masters at work when it becomes necessary or urgent.

Probably left some stuff out, it is important not to panic in an emergency as it reduces the ability to creatively think. To avoid panic it is necessary to have confidence in your trust webs (cert graphs) aka buddy networks and lovers as well as your own skills so that if you really screw up again, somebody who loves you will hopefully come help you resolve the problem in creatively synergistic ways that reaffirm life's place in the universe to the universe.

Thank you all for your time and attention regarding this matter, please do not drop urgent work of your own. I am confident that sufficient assistance will emerge to deal with this dangerous situation in responsible manner and I have rirwin here with me to reboot the local net if malfunctioning control systems or manual procedures and gatekeepers babysitting me have to shut me down to protect larger multitudes of buddies.

Sincerely with love, Michael R. Irwin,

mirwin, advogato journeyer

idot, advogato nobody, worry not. I cert him soon or provide emergency contact numbers/addresses/people

rex, apprentice

hmmmm, posted 6 Sep 2001 at 23:41 UTC by neurogato » (Journeyer)

Once again, mirwin wanders blithely off-topic - what the hell does fractal food have to do with open sourcing BeOs?

Low overhead requirement implies high quality handhelds., posted 6 Jun 2005 at 03:10 UTC by mirwin » (Master)

BEOS might be just the development language required. I am not a BEOS expert so someone else will have to perform analysis to say yeah or nay. Then the BEOS lovers can create the software tools necessary to make their case despite naysayers.

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